Originally posted by Rameau's Nephew - The firebars are far more interesting than the boos ever were, and seem to integrate a good deal more naturally into the level. Nevertheless, I think level could be made more interesting still if you had a least one or two other types of enemy in addition. As suggested earlier, it would be especially interesting to see how the blocks could be used in tandem with bouncing off of enemies.
Yes, I agree. I'll try and work in some other types of enemies into the mix. I also like the idea of bouncing of enemies in some situations as well.
Originally posted by Rameau's Nephew - While the blocks are introduced better and more gradually now, you still transition a bit abruptly from "jump between two platforms with a somewhat dangerous but still solid block between them" to "jump right at the transition, or perish". I'd recommend having at least one pairing of platforms where the player needs to jump at the transition, but with a non-fatal consequences should they fail, just to let them get more used to the rhythm before being required to make such jumps over a pit.
This is a good idea in some respects, but there are a couple of drawbacks that I almost think might outweigh the positives. For one, using the "in between" grey block sprite does not work very well for some of the longer segments, as any more than 3 blocks in a row force the player back to the "jump right at the transition" style. I feel that getting the players accustomed to this from the start of the level will train them better than using the other blocks and then having the players feel "startled" when they are suddenly expected to jump at the transition.
Originally posted by Rameau's Nephew - I'd recommend moving the highest set of blocks on screen 05 down one tile. As it stands, they lie right at the apex of Mario's jump, and should he begin to descend even slightly before they appear, he will be shunted mercilessly downward into the void. While not exactly a difficult jump, I found whether I made it or not seemed to depend a little too heavily on chance.
Alright, I'll look into lowering it a tile, though it doesn't seem to really rely on chance at all to me. Of course, being the actual designer, I am a bit biased so I can see how it could be a problem point for some players.
Originally posted by Rameau's Nephew - The "gate" setup on screen 7 has somewhat awkward timing. We, the players, tend to count in seconds, and it takes about four seconds for the block to reappear--so far, so good. Unfortunately, it takes far less than a second for Mario to make that drop, so the player needs to count to an odd "three-and-a-bit", which feels very strange and leaves little room for error.
Yeah, I can see how this setup could be a little problematic. I don't have any trouble with it, but if it seems unnecessarily difficult, I'm sure I can come up with an alternate setup.
Originally posted by Rameau's Nephew - The screen 0B - 0C block jump is unexpectedely wide (and blind) compared to what comes before, and could thus use a good old fashioned coin trail to guide the player.
I agree, though the OCD part of me then insists that I must add a coin trail to all the other jumps as well, for sake of consistency haha.
Originally posted by Rameau's Nephew - The section with the blocks as vertical barriers (0C/0D) seems rather too demanding. Firstly, this is the very first time we encounter these blocks as vertical obstacles to be avoided rather than horizontal platforms to be landed on (i.e. the exact opposite of their role hitherto), and they are not only introduced over a pit, but in a very tricky arrangement, at that. What's worse, though, is the presence of that firebar, as the player scarcely has a chance to pay attention to the barriers' pattern long enough to suss out the proper rhythm, as they have to keep diverting their attention in order to dodge that thing.
Far enough, I'll either move the firebar to a less intrusive area or remove it completely.
Originally posted by Rameau's Nephew - The coin is fine conceptually, but this particular setup strikes me as excessive, as there's absolutely no leeway as far as timing goes. Nothing short of frame-perfect timing is demanded here, with the punishment being death.
This is surprising! I managed to grab the coin on my very first try when I came up with the setup, and can consistently jump down into the "pit" and pretend to recollect the coin at least 7-8 times in a row consistently before messing up. I will look into making it slightly easier to collect though, especially if other testers have the same problem.
Originally posted by Rameau's Nephew - Generally speaking, I wish you wouldn't have limited yourself to just two oppositely timed variants of the blocks, but had also done something with the other versions which appear at different times relative to one another.
I already addressed this somewhat earlier, but I will play around with the concept and see if I can come up with something suitable in this regard.
Originally posted by Rameau's NephewAs far as æsthetics are concerned, I think the more desaturated background indeed helps a good deal. As for music, since our intended theme is "trippy", I'd recommend something a bit less uncanny and a bit more otherworldly. Ghost House 3/Cumulus Chapel (3E) has a more subdued, mystical, and wondrous feel about it (just ignore the disconcerting wheeze-o-phone solo which appears in the version currently in the ROM), which will calm the players nerves at the more frustrating jumps, just as DKC2's tricky bramble levels famously employ the soothing Stickerbrush Symphony. Perhaps even better still, however, would be Desert Ruins 2 (59), which gives a very distinctive, shaman-type "awakening" vibe, which I think makes for a particularly memorable mood for the level.
I really like the music in the Cumulus Chapel level, a little moreso than the Desert Ruins 2 theme (although it fits rather nicely too). I'd be interested in reading some more opinions on this.
Originally posted by Rameau's NephewIncidentally, what were you planning to do for the next part of the level? I, as the player, think I might be getting a little weary of these blocks for the moment after playing through this first section, so I wonder if it might not be worth introducing a completely different gimmick in the second section. You could then bring the blocks back for the finale, or better still, combine both gimmicks together to make for an especially satisfying conclusion to the level.
I wholeheartedly agree with this plan, it's pretty much exactly what I have in store for the rest of the level.
Originally posted by Biospark88EDIT: I couldn't get past a certain area of the level, even with savestates. But up to that point, here's what I have to say.
Wait, what? I know I'm the creator of the level, so it's going to be quite a bit easier for me, but I just played through the section again (without any tools, of course) and made it through on my first try. I could maybe understand some players who are not necessarily as skilled (don't take this personally by any means) having difficulty making it through toolless; however, being unable to complete it with tools is some feat! I don't mean to be rude or imply that you're a bad player, but this is really rather astonishing to me. What area were you unable to pass?
Originally posted by Biospark88Precision jumping like this is OK only sparingly. I know it's world 9, but please don't make it any longer than this.
I don't view these jumps as too precise, but I agree that the level should not be annoyingly difficult. I guess one argument I would make is that precision is not a bad type of difficulty at all, and that naturally a video game will expect more and more precision of a player as the player reaches more and more difficult levels.
Originally posted by Biospark88Blind leap of faith and hope you land on that last disappearing block.
Although the player is warned to scroll the screen, I can see how this could be somewhat troublesome, though not entirely blind (even without screen-scrolling). I think I will go Rameau's Nephew's route and add some more coin markers to make it easier for players to figure out where they should go.
Originally posted by Biospark88Slowdown.
I agree. I'll find a way to eliminate it later on.
Originally posted by Biospark88Now THIS is a pain in the ass. It took me 5 open states to get this right. Crapshoots are not fun, even in the bonus world.
I agree that this particular section could be structured somewhat better, but it is by no means a crapshoot. Luck is not involved, only timing.
Originally posted by Biospark88Hard to capture, but Mario can get stuck in the side of these blocks sometimes. Also the hitbox is a tiny bit wonky.
They seem to have many of the same physical oddities of the stretching turn blocks from the original Super Mario World. It might be worth looking into later on though...
Originally posted by Biospark88How in the hell do I get past this without breaking the level?
Watch this video (completed without tools, I might add) to see.
Video link (obsolete; removed)
I agree that it may be slightly too hard for some players.
Originally posted by Biospark88Better than before, but still feels very alpha. It needs more sprites and diverse landforms or it's bland. Please don't use the trippy BG as a crutch for empty level design here!
I can agree to this. I have a few ideas of ways to incorporate a larger variety of sprites that I will incorporate in the next build. Empty level design is something that I would never settle for.
Originally posted by Biospark88And sorry for being harsh. I have very high expectations for this hack, especially in the later levels. The bonus world has to be a satisfying reward for a skilled player to unlock and conquer.
No, I encourage straight forward discussion, it's the only way for someone to see how people feel about a level. Although I disagree about several points, I enjoy all honest feedback.
I'd like to make the point that this level should be a challenge, even for skilled players. Because of this, it's entirely understandable that those who are deficient in the skills department may encounter difficulties while trying to finish a World 9 level.
Keep up the good work!
tatanga