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Lunar Magic or Super Mario Maker?

Hey guys, I was wondering...

Which Super Mario World course editor do you like better?

Lunar Magic, or Super Mario Maker? #tb{:?}
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I think we already had this discussion about a hundred times here. The usual consensus is "Lunar Magic for overall flexibility and freedom, Super Mario Maker for user friendliness and out-of-the-box features".
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I got bored with what Super Mario Maker only allowed or encouraged me to do. Lunar Magic then?
I'm not so sure anymore that I have a concrete answer for that. Back in the day I would have readily answered 'Super Mario Maker' mainly on the basis that it's unquestionably legal, very much user-friendly, and it has such creative looking whimsical features including turning the drawing hand into a cat's paw and line guided Wigglers, even tho I have barely ever played it at all. That was before I read all this shit about levels disappearing for not getting enough stars and a word filter for level names, while well-intentioned and seems like a good idea, keeps you from naming a level "Yoshi to the Rescue." Not to mention it's one of the only games for the Wii U I can think of off the top of my head that I have much of any interest in (aside from probably Virtual Console stuff). I am kinda reluctant to buy a Wii U if that game represents the majority of the reason for getting a Wii U.
I like ROM hacks, I just don't like the fact that they're in a legal grey area.
I don't really care about the lack of features on SMM compared to LM since I like restricting myself sometimes and be as creative as possible with whatever I have.
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Originally posted by RPG Hacker
I think we already had this discussion about a hundred times here. The usual consensus is "Lunar Magic for overall flexibility and freedom, Super Mario Maker for user friendliness and out-of-the-box features".

He took the words from my mouth, I've got nothing to add.
Considering I don't have hundreds of dollars to throw at a WiiU and SMM, Lunar Magic will have to do :)

Winning argument IMO:
SMM-Individual levels
Lunar Magic- An entire game

But that's just me personally and I'm sure many would disagree ahaha (hence me stating it as an opinion rather than fact)
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I never played Super Mario Maker, but it sure looks fun. I do believe that there is a lot more you can do with Lunar Magic though, Like overworld editing or adding custom stuff. But there's also stuff you can't do in LM that you can do in SMM, like stacking enemies. But I would still prefer LM over SMM anyway.
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Lunar Magic, because it has features that you can edit most of them manually, it can edit layer 3 for the levels/overworld and it allows using file extensions when using third party tools (AddmusicK, GPS, SpriteTool, etc).

Super Mario Maker has sprite stacking and setting your own type of Mario game style in levels but it doesn't have overworld editing or your own custom music outside the Mario franchise due to legal issues.
I like them both for different reasons.

For me, Lunar Magic is good for making serious levels/hacks that are more thought out & tested. Whereas, Super Mario Maker is good for making casual levels that don't need really need too much thought put in them. #tb{:]}
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Lunar Magic of course, I don't have Super Mario Maker and couldn't honestly be bothered.

The only people are to being ranked are popular YouTube and shit levels is probably. I like non-challenging levels which have some actual skill implemented.

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Originally posted by RPG Hacker
I think we already had this discussion about a hundred times here. The usual consensus is "Lunar Magic for overall flexibility and freedom, Super Mario Maker for user friendliness and out-of-the-box features".

To respond to this thread,
Since I use Lunar Magic for my actual work, and Super Mario Maker for the fun of it...

Can my answer be space pirates?
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I got bored with Mario Maker two weeks after I got it honestly. There is SO much more you can do with Lunar Magic and SMW, while Mario Maker honestly feels so restricted to the point where it feels like Nintendo is limiting the maximum quality and variety Mario Maker levels can have, so as to not take away from their main titles.
I think it's a silly question since they are vastly different tool sets with very different results in mind. It's like comparing apples and oranges really. Yes, they both allow for designing your own Mario levels but their primary function as a level editor and to what end is worlds apart.

Lunar Magic, or more accurately, SMW ROM hacking, is extremely open ended since you're allowed to go as far as editing code if you so wish. Essentially, you're only limited by the SNES's own limitations and your own limitations (ie, coding capability, drawing capability etc.). Basically, LM with applicable externals can allow you to make a whole new game if you so desired (anyone remember Azure Chaotic?) Mario Maker, on the other hand, is a level-editing game where your freedoms are strictly limited by whatever the game's designers set in place.

A more apt comparison would be Mario Maker vs the SMBX editor as those two are more closely related, but even there the SMBX editor allows limited importing and fancy shenanigans via LunaDLL. Not to mention, I always viewed Mario Maker as a response to the SMBX editor and not SMW ROM hacking.

However, in keeping in the spirit of the thread I'll compare the two.

Both LM and MM have their advantages and disadvantages. Mario Maker has zero learning curve and is straight up plug and play. To the casual player/designer, this is perfect. Whether you're a beginner or expert designer, everyone has an equal opportunity at creating whatever their heart desires. This also includes limitations which puts every designer on equal footing.

The same isn't true for LM. While a majority of the program is easy to figure out, there are elements that come off as confusing or even frustrating to a beginner (think back to when you opened up LM for the very first time). Once you start adding external elements, it can become even more frustrating or limiting to beginner designers. The upside, however, is you have far more creative depth with LM. How far that depth goes really depends on how much time you wish to invest.

For me, while there's been some great developments on the LM/SMW hacking front over the past few years, I've also found it annoying to keep up with. I got sick of transferring ROMS every time something new came out that I wanted to take advantage of. Additionally, for all the investment that I put into a full scale hack knowing there would be no return on said investment (investment in this context obviously being time), I eventually decided to turn my efforts elsewhere (original game design that could possibly be marketable one day if I so wished). However, I'll still return to LM for one off events here at SMWC if one interests me enough. Besides, there's still an undeniable charm about LM and the ability to redesign an old personal favorite game from my childhood.

Mario Maker, however, has filled that desire to make some quick and dirty Mario levels without feeling like I have to sit down and organize a boatload of files and ROM addresses. Sure, there's some stuff I'd love to see added to Mario Maker, but honestly, I can live with what it has because I know everyone else who uses it also has to live with the same limitations. Although I will say I wish Nintendo would stop focusing on useless costumes that are only usable in one mode and start coming out with some actual DLC worthy material.

Therefore, for the purpose of making Mario levels, Mario Maker is really all I need. If I'm looking to make a full blown game, well...I'll look elsewhere and make my own game. Don't have much interest in making Mario hacks anymore. Though, I'll admit, I was recently thumbing through an old hack of mine and thought it would be nice to revisit it and give it a complete overhaul with the latest LM and contemporary tools.
THEY'RE DIFFERENT THINGS JESUS CHRIST
Depends.
Originally posted by Sokobansolver
I'm not so sure anymore that I have a concrete answer for that.

I take that back. After listening to this video, I might have to go with Lunar Magic. Lack of transparency tends to make me antsy.
Legacy custom music
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SMW hacking channel

The word filter thing raises an interesting question or two:

What's with the four number restriction? Does it somehow fuck up the filter's code or what?
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If it's just Lunar Magic by itself, then it's Super Mario Maker. If it's Lunar Magic with Addmusic, Sprite Tool, GPS, YY-CHR 0.98 and Asar with resources from this site, then I'd go for Lunar Magic any day.
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Originally posted by Sokobansolver
That was before I read all this shit about levels disappearing for not getting enough stars and a word filter for level names, while well-intentioned and seems like a good idea, keeps you from naming a level "Yoshi to the Rescue."


Well, so much for making another Yoshi Tower in Mario Maker. I still never understood the one in Yoshi's Island DS that if Yoshi owned the place, why did everything want him dead?

Well anyway, Lunar Magic (especially with everything else) gives you a lot more freedom once you know how to use it, especially if you can code 65c816 assembly, as opposed to Mario Maker which is more constrained, as much as I would like to stack a bunch of enemies for the sake of a gimmick in Lunar Magic.

And, what Nintendo did to PangaeaPanga's channel was still a pretty low blow.